Palestinians are actually Jordanian refugees from the West Bank that became refugees after Israel won the 1967 war and acquired those territories. Jordan initially allowed some now renamed palestinians into Jordan, but as they cause the civil war of Black September, they were expelled.
As for “it wasn’t an empty land”, well no. But the land was ruled by someone and that someone weren’t the residents of the land. At the time the rulers were the British and the British gave that land to the U.N to form a partition to create 2 independent countries: a Jewish state and an Arab state. Jews said yes, Arab said n and declared war and tough for them, the newly formed Jewish state won and Israel’s independence was declared. No, the Jews didn’t “steal” land. Actually, many Arabs chose to stay in what was to become Israel and became the first Arab citizens of Israel. 150,000 approximately, now about 2 million Arab citizens (I guess we suck at genocide ). Others chose to leave, trusting their big Arab brothers would soon get rid of the Jews and then they could go back. Didn’t quite turned out that way, tough.
Nothing illegal, or twisted or insidious about how Israel finally came to exist again. It’s a story of successful decolonization. And I’m sorry, but the biggest colonizers in history? Arabs. Half the countries in the Arab League have no business being Arab. Arabs arrived at lands that not only weren’t empty, but they actually belong to another group f people, they violently conquered and converted and colonized them in the name of Islamic imperialism. But OMG, Jews going back to their indigenous land, which was given by the rulers of the time is oh-so evil!!
Quorra2.0 wrote: ↑Thu May 02, 2024 3:26 pmDo you think Jews left for almost 2000 yrs and the Palestinians have been there since biblical times? That’s how your reply reads, the first is inaccurate and the second is complicated. There were population fluctuations. Despite expulsion, massacre, and slavery the population was never zero. There were Jews in what is present day Israel during the Byzantine Empire, The Kingdom of Jerusalem, the Mamaluk, the Ottoman Empire, etc. “Palestinians” or more accurately people who identify as Palestinian today didn’t exist as Palestinian before the Palestinian movement, which began by Arabs in Mandatory Palestine to counter Zionism. Prior to this Palestinian was a term used for all people in Mandatory Palestine: Jews, Christian, Muslim, Arabs, as a way to strip identity and considered insulting. A couple years ago there was a change.org petition wanting 23 and me to add Palestinian to the ancestry profile, but like Israel, the genetics is too much of a hodgepodge that cluster groups to identify as Palestinian or Israeli is not possible. Same is true for Americans unless they are indigenous Americans. Levantine Corridor has a complicated history and people on various sides use that complicated history over simplify it and propagandize it.Della wrote: ↑Mon Apr 29, 2024 12:25 pm"Here is the definition: A Zionist is a person who desires or supports the establishment of a Jewish state in the Land of Israel, which in the future will become the state of the Jewish people. This is based on what Herzl said: “In Basel I founded the Jewish state.”Quorra2.0 wrote: ↑Mon Apr 29, 2024 10:59 am
Wells added a link to the article that isn’t behind a paywall. I’m not a fan of Wikipedia as it can be user edited but with Yehoshua his quotes are very contextual. Up until a few years before his death, he supported a 2 state solution. He never denied Palestinians their identity but was always looking at viable peaceful solutions of equality. Towards his death, he no longer thought this was possible with a 2 state solution, not because of fear, hatred, or distrust but because he didn’t see it as being viable for equality and peace.
The key word in this definition is “state,” and its natural location is the Land of Israel because of the Jewish people’s historical link to it."
The bolded sections. That's the entire issue with Zionism. That wasn't a land sitting empty and waiting for their return. They're almost 2000 years removed. What gave anyone the right to just move the other people who had been living there since biblical times?