Slimshandy wrote: ↑Sat Dec 09, 2023 9:39 am
WellPreserved wrote: ↑Sat Dec 09, 2023 9:23 am
SallyMae wrote: ↑Fri Dec 08, 2023 10:03 pm
Inappropriate how? At risk of what? ETA: I don't disagree, I want to know what your specific objections are.
In Florida, there is not a significant difference between a bar (minors allowed if accompanied by an adult) and a nightclub (no minors allowed). Both are allowed to have low food to alcohol ratio of sales, both are allowed to have live entertainment. A nightclub, however, is permitted to have entertainment past midnight. Hotels, convention centers, outdoor events don't usually have the same age restrictions. Minors can't go to a rave at a nightclub but they can attend an outdoor rave (Miami has a HUGE one every year) and minors can obviously attend festivals where entertainment goes on 24-7.
If minors are present, all establishments have to abide by obscenity laws when it comes to entertainment which is why minors are not allowed into strip clubs and some nightclubs have "adult" entertainment and what is considered "obscene" is pretty clearly laid out in the statute - display of genitals, sexual intercourse, etc. Where DeSantis got into trouble was vaguely expanding those obscenity laws in his effort to ban drag shows. I mean what's lewd to one person may not be lewd to another. When is a prosthetic vagina, penis, and breasts part of the costume and when is it obscene? Same with "simulating sexual activity". Would that include twerking? No minors at a Madonna concert?
The former laws on the books were pretty clearly defined and there was no reason to expand them except to stick it to the drag queens and I'm glad that courts are agreeing.
If a couple of seven year old kids went to a playground dressed as a penis + vagina and then started simulating sexual activity… would that be taken as a funny joke, or would that be seen as lewd behavior, and possible evidence that these kids might be being abused?
A huge reason we don’t allow kids to partake in this kind of live entertainment is that kids mimic what they see.
We never decided that adults using genuine genitalia as entertainment in front of children was bad, but using prosthetic genitals was acceptable… this is not something we just started thinking was unacceptable entertainment for kids because of drag queens , it’s always been the status quo …
Is that a thing? Are parents sending their kids to 2nd grade dressed as penises and vaginas?
Kid's do sometimes mimic what they see but if mimicking is the primary concern, perhaps we should be equally concerned about the portrayal of violence?
I've attended a lot of drag shows since I was in high school. Some have been for children (Drag Queen Story Hour), some have been children must be accompanied by a parent, and some have been for adults only and in my experience, the content usually appropriate for the audience. I've never seen a life-like exposed prosthetic penis or vagina at the shows I've attended and I do agree that wouldn't be appropriate for minor children.
However, I also agree with the Florida higher court ruling that the bill, as written, is too vague and unfairly targets drag queens. Here is the text of the Florida statute:
827.11 Exposing children to an adult live performance.—
97 (1) As used in this section, the term:
98 (a) “Adult live performance” means any show, exhibition, or
99 other presentation in front of a live audience which, in whole
100 or in part, depicts or simulates nudity, sexual conduct, sexual
101 excitement, or specific sexual activities as those terms are
102 defined in s. 847.001 lewd conduct, or the lewd exposure of
103 prosthetic or imitation genitals or breasts when it:
104 1. Predominantly appeals to a prurient, shameful, or morbid
105 interest;
106 2. Is patently offensive to prevailing standards in the
107 adult community of this state as a whole with respect to what is
108 suitable material or conduct for the age of the child present;
109 and
110 3. Taken as a whole, is without serious literary, artistic,
111 political, or scientific value for the age of the child present.
Between turtleneck and bare chested, what exposure of a Drag Queen's prosthetic breasts would be offensive to the adult community of Florida? If you were a venue, would you feel comfortable booking a drag show and making that call?
Of course DeSantis wants to specifically target Drag Shows. The particular show in question toured the east coast with it's final destination in Florida and DeSantis was trying to shut it down before it reached The Sunshine State, backed vocally by Majorie Taylor Greene, Libs of Tik Toc, and Mom's for Liberty. DeSantis's undercover investigators determined that there was no lewd conduct at the shows but DeSantis dismissed their report and declared drag shows are a pubic nuisance according to a 1948 Florida Statute. It's Drag Queen (and transgender) panic. Drag Queens have been around forever so why now the panic in conservative states? Because it's fueling the Republican culture wars. But the last election cycle demonstrated that Americans aren't as interested in the culture wars anymore so we are seeing Republican politicians moving on. I imagine that DeSantis will drop it rather than appeal and move on to something else to be angry about.
"The books that the world calls immoral are books that show its own shame." - Oscar Wilde
